Mastering performance, preparation, and pressure with Bennie Fowler – Part 1

Transcript: 

Adam: Welcome back to the Reed Smith's Disputes and Perspective podcast. I'm Adam Massaro. I'm a partner in the Denver office of the newly founded Reed Smith office here in Denver. And I've got a special guest on my hands here today, Bennie Fowler. Bennie Fowler, why don't you introduce yourself to the audience, please?

Bennie: Geez, I mean, I don't know where to start, but yeah, I'm a good friend of yours. I think we've been friends since 2020. We've been able to support the polo event that you do. Played eight years in the NFL. Had a blast there. Won a Super Bowl here in Denver and caught Peyton Manning's last pass in Super Bowl 50. And that led to me staying in the league for a while. Because if you can play with Peyton, you can play in any offense, you know, just based on how rigorous it is. And went on to play two more years in Denver, two years in New York with the Giants, one in New Orleans with the Saints, and then a cup of coffee in 2021 with the 49ers in training camp and then retired. At the beginning of 2022, wrote a book, Silver Spoon, The Imperfect Guide to Success. And now the director of strategic development at Caprock, a multifamily office serving ultra high net worth families, entrepreneurs, C-suite executives, athletes and entertainers.

Adam: Well, I appreciate it. And, you know, part of what I like to do on this pod is, to me, the inspiration comes from looking at parallel practices or parallel professions to the legal practice, and then trying to pull on some of those extreme achievement environments, and then look at ways that we can draw some connections to the lawyer world, which is, you know, what I'm into. But at the same time, I think we as lawyers sometimes are a little bit too narrow in what we can do and I think there's a lot of opportunity in the sports world to draw parallels, things like that. So I've got a bunch of topics for you today and we're going to kind of cover the spectrum but where I want to start is visualization and I want to go into a couple different areas there because I think it's a very tried and true area in professional sports and sports in general but it doesn't get enough play in litigation, especially what I do with just complex lit. So I want to talk a little bit about visualization and I'm going to pull on some pieces there, but give me a little background with your experience with it and how long you've been doing it.

Bennie: I think visualization is really important. And I think this is more of a conversation between you and myself and hopefully the audience one day I'll come back on and hear some of the questions that they have. But you have to be able to see yourself doing these things before they actually come into play. So when I think about playing at the highest level. Yes, visualization is a huge part of it. And all athletes, I would say top athletes, people who get to the professionals have some sort of visualization practice, whether they're conscious of it or not. I think their visualization can look and happen in so many different ways. Sometimes I would get in my own head when it comes to, first of all, I knew that it was important, but sometimes I get into my own head of not always seeing the outcome I wanted to see. But visualization actually takes a tremendous amount of practice. I know some people who are really good at it can always see the outcome. I liked guided visualization. So I had coaches help me do the mental rehearsary of what I was trying to accomplish and achieve. So, you know, they would walk me through where, hey, these are some of the plays that I know I'm for sure going to be in on. And we walk through and paint the picture in your mind, eyes closed, paint the picture in your mind of what you want this play to look like. Where's your split, your breath, the environment, the stadium that you're playing in, executing that play, and just working on that over and over again. And it's crazy how you've done this before, obviously, Adam, because we've talked about this and had these types of conversations. But when you actually think about how things actually play out in real time, it's really cool to see it actually come to fruition on a Sunday or when you're in trial and you're like, oh no, I've seen this movie before. I've been here before. I think that's where one of those scenes or not that set, not scenes, but what that saying, where that saying actually comes from. Oh, I've seen this movie before because you've actually walked through it. I think when you think about some of the great actors and I was able to see my wife took me to see Denzel Washington and Jake Gyllenhaal in that Shakespeare play and the performance was incredible by both of them but. Not only did they practice it and rehearse that, but I'm sure they had tons of visualization of just going through these different moments in the play and how they wanted to act and how they wanted the audience to feel. So I think visualization is one of the most important things for anybody to be successful. If you're getting ready to go into a performance environment or you just want certain things to play out a certain way, you can visualize before a meeting, A board meeting, a staff meeting, a meeting that you're getting ready to have one-on-one or a conversation that you can have with your significant other. I think you can visualize those things. How do you want this to go and start playing that over in your mind of how you want to enter the room, how you want to have the conversation. So visualization is one of the most important things. And it doesn't always have to be with your eyes closed. I think it can be done in a walkthrough setting. So, when you're playing in the NFL, the way we also visualize is by walking through plays. And we'll walk through 50 to 60 plays. You don't have that many guys in the NFL, so you... How do you take the reps off, the fast reps or the reps where you're going 100% of the time? You can't do 200 plays in a week. So you'll walk through 150, 160 plays. And you'll walk through and you'll visualize the defense and you'll see the defense out there and you will walk through certain scenarios and situations. And it's one of the reasons why I was able to just learn a tremendous amount playing with Peyton my first couple of years because how many reps that we did and we visualized or we walk through these things. And I walk through to me is just a different form of visualization.

Adam: I appreciate that. And I think for the audience, sometimes it's easy to say it's hard to do it. So I like to sort of set the tone of the most basic types of visualizations you can do. And for me, at least a big component is getting them set and setting right. So for me, if I can do it, like perfect example is I love doing it in my sauna because I just know I'm walled in there, perfect location. But let's start with like best locations for visualizations. Then we can figure out sort of the triage spots. But if you've got one spot, where is it?

Bennie: I mean, it really depends on, well, when I was playing, it was always in the hotel. You know, that's, you got your hotel room and it's just you in there. You got your plays, you got your playbook. You have some of the pictures of the defense. You have your scouting report and you can kind of just visualize it. I thought it was easy for me to just visualize at the hotel. And then I would do a little bit of visualization, you know, just in my morning routine, either before I got to the facility or, you know, right when I did get to the facility in the player's lounge. So you could visualize three to four plays like that. So I think it's, it really just depends on your, you know, what you're trying to accomplish and achieve and where do you get the most quiet and where you can quiet your mind. So for you, that's the sauna.

Adam: Now, one other piece of the visualization that I like to do is take it to its logical end, which is to actually take a look at an image of what I'm focused on. So a prime example for me is one of the most calming things I can do is typically when I know I have a trial, we know months, years in advance, we're going to have a trial date. And so I will often go in and I do a pre-setup of the actual courtroom. And then I'll actually take a picture of the courtroom when I'm in there. And then I put it on my phone so I see it over and over again. And then I just look at that thing back and forth. And it's really helpful. Do you do any imagery visualization as far as looking at particular pictures, things like that as well?

Bennie: Oh, yeah, for sure. If I'm getting ready to speak on stage, look at the stage, and do a walkthrough of the stage a day before or hours before people get in there. For the stadiums that I played in, definitely would get a picture. Or, you know, you just, yeah, you can get pictures of it or you've played in it before. And I think, you know, you try to get, I try to, for imagery, I try to bring in as much of what I've seen before. The grass the smells i try to bring in all of the the senses when i am doing when i am doing visualization but yeah definitely a picture of the stadium when i was playing and also you know bringing in positive pictures as well of past performances or moments as moments from the week before.

Adam: You know, the other thing I think it's interesting connection, because you think about visualization being quiet, which can be very true. But there's also, to me at least, there's this great connection between visualization and music as well, especially in my mind, where there's something about the right jam that helps you get to that visualization point, especially to your point, like sort of the subconscious, right, where you're going to the event itself, all those things. But do you have a sense or have you considered you know the music aspect of it and how you use that if at all to sort of get that same mindset?

Bennie: I think that's interesting I've never. Done visualization with the music piece of it I've always it's always been pretty quiet, or me kind of talking out loud through the plays of where i see things how i see the defender how i see the play going i will talk it out but I've never used music so you've used music before and to get you into that flow state of visualization?

Adam: Yeah, there's something in my view that you, to your point, you know, there can be the deliberate. I sit there in a room, I get all the senses, right? But in my view, I think there's a way if you have the right jam to get sort of into a different spot. In some respects, it can get you in the subconscious faster, it feels like as well. It's just something that, and it just sort of allows for a free flowing. Oftentimes, Sometimes it's just in my view, there's something there that has it. And I don't know what exactly it is, but it's something that is an alternative way to get to the same spot.

Bennie: Yeah. Yeah, I think that's one of the best things about visualization is that it can look different for anybody and everybody. It doesn't have to look one way and your way is going to be different than my way. But the most important thing is that we practice it.

Adam: How about when it comes to motivating others in that area? Have you had any techniques to help others get on board with it? Because I think the hardest part is this, that first step of doing it. And then once you start doing it, you see benefits. But it's easy to say it as a kind of an internal practice. But have you had any success or how do you impute the value to others or get them doing it as well?

Bennie: You know what? I've never tried to force it on anybody. I would always share what's working for me. And hopefully my play spoke for itself in the way I would go about certain things, especially during training camp or times where there was a lot of pressure on me to make the team or make a play. And I would kind of talk about my week or my practice of visualization, but I never kind of forced it or tried to motivate people to do it. I think, you know, some people lean into visualization and some of the mind and how powerful the mind is. And some people are just naturally gifted and they kind of do it naturally or have it naturally in their process without even thinking about it. So I never tried to force that on anybody.

Adam: I want to switch and talk a little bit about pressure because that's something you mentioned. Pressure to make the team, pressure to succeed. And it's something that I think, especially as you continue to progress, it becomes more and more both a positive and a negative in that respect.

Bennie: What do you mean more positive and a negative? Tell me more about that.

Adam: Okay. Well, first of all, Mr. Fowler, this is a lawyer podcast. So, you know, I get to ask all the questions. So let me just reset that expectation. I'm kidding. Yes. I think as you scale a practice for private practice that I'm in, it is a positive and negative in the sense that you become more motivated because the pressure motivates you. But the pressure also becomes potentially unbearable because it's there all the time. And it's not something that goes away with years of experience. I think it's one of those things where it can be potentially challenging to process it in a way that is healthy and figure out ways to get sort of the complete upside to it because there's a trade-off. So to me, it feels like you can't get to a higher level without ingesting the pressure, but you are gonna cap out on my view if you can't figure out how to handle the pressure on top of that, right? So success isn't just tied to doing the best. Success, in my view, is tied to how you can handle the pressure to break through that next ceiling to get to the next thing because you can't be successful if the pressure is tearing you down inside to make it a negative is the experience I've had, but also the viewpoint I've come to on this topic.

Bennie: Yeah, I think pressure is definitely a privilege. That's one of those cliche sayings. But also, yeah, that makes a ton of sense. And there's a lot of parallels to sports right there. The pressure to make the team or when you're the number one pick, the pressure to meet expectations and surpass those expectations. I think one of the best things about sports and pressure is that there are seasons. Like, you know, when the season's over, the pressure dies down a little bit. So you get a chance to reset, reflect, refocus, and recharge your batteries to get ready for the next season. I think one of the things that's different about life is that pressure can hit you at all different times. You can always think about it because you don't know what season you're in. And, you know, it could be kids, could be family. It could be also work. It could be other things, health. So there are just different points and times in your life where it seems like there's pressure all the time. You know you said earlier at the beginning of the podcast is that you guys know years, in advance or months in advance when you're going to trial so how do you build up to, have that healthy pressure because you have pressure because you want to do well and you want to perform well you have a high high stakes job and you want to win and I think that's where pressure comes in but yeah every day can't be pressure it's what does it look like and I think you know. When you want to handle pressure better, what is your process? Because I think sometimes when you don't have your process in place, pressure can mount because you don't know what you need to accomplish on a given day or a given week or a given month. So when you're in the NFL, every day, every Monday looks the same for the all 18 weeks. Every Tuesday looks the same. Every Wednesday looks the same. The pressure's all on Sunday. We're going to have pressure build up throughout the week with our game plan on first and second down, third down, red zone, special situations, end of the game situations, end of half situations. And then on Sunday, that's where the pressure really mounts. And then you get a chance to reset, reflect, refocus, recharge on Monday and Tuesday, and you go do it again. So every day can't be a crazy amount of pressure, though. So I think that's where you, you know, where's your process? And do you have a process in place to accomplish or help you understand what you're trying to accomplish to take some of that pressure off of you.

Adam: You know, it's interesting to build on that concept because when you think about life arc, right, so I'm 40, you hit this sort of age piece where you have the pressures of not knowing if you're going to have a job, not knowing if, for example, am I going to do the right things to do whatever I need to do to get out of college or sort of figure out my path in life, you know, have my first home, whatever. You know, those are those types of pressures that are somewhat sort of built in, which kind of naturally push you. And then you get to the point where you're like, okay, there's not this extrinsic pressure that's just sort of based on, I've got these societal goals. It's now like you're focused a little bit more on what do I want to do and what does that look like where it's now somewhat self-invited pressure as opposed to pressure that's external facing. And so it's an interesting kind of dynamic there because you have this sort of transition where for the longest time, you're like, just head down, just got to survive, get to the next sort of life chapter. And then you get to the point where you're like, well, no, I want to look and figure out what I want to do next in that respect. And what's interesting about that kind of progression for a normal person is then you overlay that with your experience. So, for example, you were at the highest pressure cooker in the world in your late 20s, early 30s. What is it like to then transition to a whole different pressure environment, but I can't necessarily imagine it's the same compared to what you did before?

Bennie: No, definitely not the same, but there's definitely pressure because you have goals that you want to accomplish and achieve. And I think it comes into family comes more into play as you get older as a player. And yeah. How can you set yourself up? First, I didn't have a huge contract. So there's still more money to be made, more opportunity, more impact to have. So yeah, pressure is definitely not the same. When you're in training camp and you're an undrafted free agent, that's a tremendous amount of pressure because this is the goal and dream that you wanted since you were five, six years old is to be a professional athlete and play at the highest level and win and. Now you're playing with Peyton Manning, and the level of pressure that's added when you play with a guy like that is unbelievable. So I don't think there's anything in life right now where I could walk into a situation and it would be that type of pressure unless I went back into sports as a coach or something like that, where the pressure is on you to perform in front of millions of people or get somebody ready to perform in front of millions of people. And the way that you perform and the outcomes that you have on Sunday determine your livelihood. And even if you do win, there's still a chance that you can still be replaced. They work people out every Tuesday in the NFL to replace you. There's 15, 20 guys that come into every NFL facility on Monday and Tuesday, and your team works them out to see if they can find somebody else to replace you during that season or in the future. If you're a guy who is in the middle of the roster, kind of like how I was. So tremendous amount of pressure. I think the pressure now on myself is to how do I become a great husband and hopefully father soon in my life? And then also how do I just show up and what's the impact that I really want to leave on the world? You can have and make a whole bunch of money, but what's the impact that I can have? And I think that's a different type of pressure because I've been blessed to have a platform and make some good money. And then also, you know, play professional sports. So what does it look like to really leave a legacy? So I think that's a different type of pressure, but it's a healthy type of pressure to show up and be the best version of yourself.

Adam: And to wrap up this topic on pressure, when you're in the NFL, and I can only imagine the magnitude of the whole process, was there one or two things that you learned as a coping mechanism to work through that pressure at the apex that you've been able to carry through?

Bennie: Meditation, for sure. Meditation, breathing techniques is one of the things that I learned, but the pressure the NFL does is very, it's a lot on you personally, it's a lot on the team, but the way that the week is set up, it's set up for you to be prepared to handle the pressure and have a pressure plan. Like we would go through, An example of this would be when you're playing, you have these blitz periods on Wednesday and Thursday of all the blitzes that the defense will do of the team that you're playing against on Sunday. You walk through these blitzes and you walk through them over and over again. Different situations, different times they've done these blitzes. You walk through it, then you walk through it again, and then you practice it. So then when you see it in the game, yeah, of course, it's pressure, they're blitzing, but you've walked through this, you've handled this, you visualize this. So I think pressure sometimes, if you know that there are opportunities or there are going to be pressure moments in your life or in the future, how do you start preparing for them now? Something like I think about that right now that, you know, just as we're talking is, you know, just as you get older, yeah, there's going to be pressure. There's going to be pressure in your life. So how do you handle it? Well, if you're healthy mentally, physically, spiritually, you'll be ready for pressure situations. I'm not saying they're going to be easy, but if you have a strong faith, you're a healthy person, you got a healthy diet, you work out, you can handle more stress than other people. Athletes can handle stress because all those things are kind of checked off. Oh, we do hot tub, we do cold tub, we do sauna, we work out, we take care of our body. So yeah, I'm not saying, you know, I definitely had some dark times and tough times of, you know, failing and bad performances, but you know, you can cope and go through those situations because you've checked all the things that you actually can do.

Adam: Well, Bennie, I appreciate your time today. We're going to follow up with a second one because we certainly just couldn't cover all of it in one. But we're going to talk a little bit about capacity building, overcoming mistakes, and a few of those other mental well-being things you just mentioned here. But join us for the second round of this podcast coming up. This is the Reed Smith Disputes and Perspective. Bennie, thank you for joining for part one.

Bennie: Appreciate you having me.

Outro: Disputes and Perspective is a Reed Smith production. This podcast was produced by Shannon Ryan and edited by Julian Baughman. For more information about Reed Smith's litigation and dispute resolution practice please email [email protected]. You can find our podcast on podcast streaming platforms, reedsmith.com, and our social media accounts at Reed Smith LLP.

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